Comments on: Weblog Update: November 2006

By: Ferdinand Engelbeen

Ferdinand Engelbeen — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 14:44:50 +0000

Some different (but related) question here:

Next week Wednesday, there is some discussion here (Flanders, Belgium) about Al Gore’s film “And Inconvenient Truth”. I haven’t seen the film, only a few parts of it. Is there some critique on-line that gives a short view of what is said in the film (and what is true or exaggerated)? The US version on DVD is just released, but the European versions will follow later, too late for the discussion, I suppose.

By: Rev Jackson

Rev Jackson — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:02:35 +0000

Re $54, 55: The longer I hang around here Mr Bloom, the more evident it becomes that “by their fruits ye shall know them”.

That applies to Dr Juckes (I fear a sad disappointment to Concerned of Berkely), yourself, Lee and some of the other AGW advocates that turn up at this site.

By: James Lane

James Lane — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 08:13:03 +0000

Lee:

Note that Martin Juckes is being put through that mill just now, although he seems a little more willing than most to dish back.

I think Martin’s performance on this blog has been pitiful. Let’s see if the debate on CoP is any better.

By: John Reid

John Reid — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 05:24:28 +0000

No Sorry

It is Gore Gored Monckton Replies that I can’t get into

By: c newin

c newin — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 05:11:45 +0000

Re#55. It seems to me, that Dr. Jukes is putting
himself “through the mill”.

By: John Reid

John Reid — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 05:10:03 +0000

I can no longer access Monbiot vs Monckton round 2.

Has it had too many posts and used up all the available memory again?

By: Gerald Machnee

Gerald Machnee — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 04:21:14 +0000

Re #55. **BTW, there’s getting to be a pretty long list of scientists who’ve had similar experiences here.**
Really? We do not have a list of them. They would not have a problem here if they engage in genuine scientific analysis and commentary.
**Note that Martin Juckes is being put through that mill just now, although he seems a little more willing than most to dish back.**
How many of his responses have been to the point? Has he actually done a “new” study or rehashed old work? His “list” of faults is growing too.

By: Steve Bloom

Steve Bloom — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 00:26:56 +0000

Re #53: But gb, we come to this discussion *knowing* the models are wrong. It’s just a matter of finding out why. At the very least we can endlessly discuss why we think that’s the case.

On another thread some weeks back (probably not now accessible due to the hosting problems), Isaac Held made an appearance here and stated his willingness to explain some things about models. I mentioned to the locals that they would drive Isaac away if they badgered him to justify climate science and modeling from first principles (which they couldn’t resist because they just *know* those first principles are wrong), but sure enough they couldn’t restrain themselves and Isaac soon departed.

BTW, there’s getting to be a pretty long list of scientists who’ve had similar experiences here. Note that Martin Juckes is being put through that mill just now, although he seems a little more willing than most to dish back.

By: Steve Bloom

Steve Bloom — Tue, 05 Dec 2006 00:08:38 +0000

Re #49: It was the “widely” claim I was concerned with. Was it published elsewhere? If not, “narrowly” might be a better term to use. In any case, I think Monchton’s family connections have sufficient publication pull only at the Torygraph. Any other media outlet would have asked some tough questions about Monckton’s credentials before even looking at that tissue of fantasies.

Regarding the hockey stick as an object of veneration, I would point out that I am *not* Canadian.

By: gb

gb — Mon, 04 Dec 2006 17:08:06 +0000

Re # 51. The point you are missing is that not all scales are modelled in GCM’s (and weather forecast models) and PDE’s are solved, not ODE’s. The larger (chaotic) scales are resolved on the numerical grid. Therefore, weather forecast models have a limited predictablity. Weather forecast models, GCM’s, dns codes don’t converge to a steady state solution (in contrast to commercial CFD codes where indeed all scales are modelled). All these models diverge after a finite time if a small initial perturbation is imposed.