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	<title>Comments on: More ISO-2000 Weather Stations from Jones and Hansen</title>
	<atom:link href="http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/</link>
	<description>by Steve McIntyre</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 18 May 2013 19:12:55 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Belongie</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-297455</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Belongie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jul 2011 20:33:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-297455</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Found this today while looking up some other things. The pictured station is NOT the USHCN station at the Redding AP. The pictured station was used for fire weather conditions not climate data reporting.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Found this today while looking up some other things. The pictured station is NOT the USHCN station at the Redding AP. The pictured station was used for fire weather conditions not climate data reporting.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: jack beazley</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89745</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jack beazley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Jun 2008 10:00:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89745</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[At the historical Lake Spaulding site, there wasn&#039;t any warming. Its time series looks like Orland.
great place]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At the historical Lake Spaulding site, there wasn&#8217;t any warming. Its time series looks like Orland.<br />
great place</p>
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		<title>By: JerryB</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89744</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JerryB]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Nov 2007 12:38:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89744</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Weber,

That url does accept ftp connections; I just tried it and it connected fine.

BTW, that is not a station; it is a collection site for data of many stations.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Weber,</p>
<p>That url does accept ftp connections; I just tried it and it connected fine.</p>
<p>BTW, that is not a station; it is a collection site for data of many stations.</p>
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	</item>
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		<title>By: Weber</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89743</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Weber]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:16:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89743</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Some weather stations like this one ftp://tgftp.nws.noaa.gov/data/observations/metar/decoded/ from 10. November 2007 doesn&#039;t allow FTP connection by using FTP but only HTTP. Does anybody know for the stations that allow using FTP end that are free?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some weather stations like this one <a href="ftp://tgftp.nws.noaa.gov/data/observations/metar/decoded/" rel="nofollow">ftp://tgftp.nws.noaa.gov/data/observations/metar/decoded/</a> from 10. November 2007 doesn&#8217;t allow FTP connection by using FTP but only HTTP. Does anybody know for the stations that allow using FTP end that are free?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: John F. Pittman</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89742</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[John F. Pittman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2007 21:40:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89742</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[#227 you said
&lt;blockquote&gt;You cannot do this by simply looking at proxies such as census figures and electricity bills, or you will still be left with the question of how good the proxy is. Parker&#039;s methodology is aimed squarely at UHI and UHI trends, not at “urbanization” as such.&lt;/blockquote&gt; But this is the nature of proxies as not only the AGW authors have done but as Parker has done. He did not use actual wind data but used proxie data. I agree it is suspect, but to take Earle Williams to task is to take Parker to task. That Parker explained his assumption. proxies has nothing to do with whether or not he used a proxy or made a bad assumption. He simply looked at, used, assumed a proxy, why can&#039;t Williams? By any sane reasoning someone who asked why can&#039;t Parker discern a UHI when it has been documented as well or better than GW?  After all continued UHI should be assumed more correct than Parker&#039;s proxy. paper, or assumptions. Translation is either his proxy or assumptions are incorrect, or perhaps all these proxies have a fundamental problem when extrapolated beyond verifiable constraints..such as Briffa, Parker, MBH98, IPCC TAR, etc.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#227 you said</p>
<blockquote><p>You cannot do this by simply looking at proxies such as census figures and electricity bills, or you will still be left with the question of how good the proxy is. Parker&#8217;s methodology is aimed squarely at UHI and UHI trends, not at “urbanization” as such.</p></blockquote>
<p> But this is the nature of proxies as not only the AGW authors have done but as Parker has done. He did not use actual wind data but used proxie data. I agree it is suspect, but to take Earle Williams to task is to take Parker to task. That Parker explained his assumption. proxies has nothing to do with whether or not he used a proxy or made a bad assumption. He simply looked at, used, assumed a proxy, why can&#8217;t Williams? By any sane reasoning someone who asked why can&#8217;t Parker discern a UHI when it has been documented as well or better than GW?  After all continued UHI should be assumed more correct than Parker&#8217;s proxy. paper, or assumptions. Translation is either his proxy or assumptions are incorrect, or perhaps all these proxies have a fundamental problem when extrapolated beyond verifiable constraints..such as Briffa, Parker, MBH98, IPCC TAR, etc.</p>
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		<title>By: David Smith</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89741</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Smith]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2007 13:08:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89741</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In the old days of burning trash in barrels, people would elevate the bottom with 2x4s or small limbs or bricks (if available), in order to keep the bottom of the barrel dry. Otherwise moisture is trapped beneath the barrel and the bottom rusts out. This is a big problem. The barrels also often had small holes poked in the bottom for internal drainage.

Temperature is not a concern because of wood&#039;s high ignition point, the lack of flame impingement and the accumulation of ash in the bottom.

(Yes, when I was a young kid we had a trash-burning barrel and I was a fire bug.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the old days of burning trash in barrels, people would elevate the bottom with 2x4s or small limbs or bricks (if available), in order to keep the bottom of the barrel dry. Otherwise moisture is trapped beneath the barrel and the bottom rusts out. This is a big problem. The barrels also often had small holes poked in the bottom for internal drainage.</p>
<p>Temperature is not a concern because of wood&#8217;s high ignition point, the lack of flame impingement and the accumulation of ash in the bottom.</p>
<p>(Yes, when I was a young kid we had a trash-burning barrel and I was a fire bug.)</p>
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		<title>By: Neal J. King</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89740</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Neal J. King]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 23:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89740</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[#227: Correction:

&quot;Where there is no calm-windy trend, Parker is not claiming a lack of urbanization, but a lack of UHI.&quot;

=&gt;

&quot;Where there is no calm-windy trend, Parker is not claiming a lack of urbanization, but a lack of UHI &lt;b&gt;trend&lt;/b&gt;.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#227: Correction:</p>
<p>&#8220;Where there is no calm-windy trend, Parker is not claiming a lack of urbanization, but a lack of UHI.&#8221;</p>
<p>=&gt;</p>
<p>&#8220;Where there is no calm-windy trend, Parker is not claiming a lack of urbanization, but a lack of UHI <b>trend</b>.&#8221;</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Neal J. King</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89739</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Neal J. King]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 23:36:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89739</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[#220: Earle Williams:

Where there is no calm-windy trend, Parker is not claiming a lack of urbanization, but a lack of UHI.

It is conceivable that there could be increasing urbanization w/o increasing UHI. This brings us back into the regime of urban cool spots &amp; parks.

So if you want to falsify Parker&#039;s hypothesis, it seems to me that you have to:

a) Measure directly the UHI, by comparing neighboring (but differently urbanized) points;

b) Establish a trend in the UHI over time; and

c) Demonstrate that this trend DOES NOT show up in the calm-windy temperature measurement signal.

This would be very welcome. However, I point out that it will take:
- Space: to do a direct UHI measurement; and
- Time: to see how the trends develop.

You cannot do this by simply looking at proxies such as census figures and electricity bills, or you will still be left with the question of how good the proxy is. Parker&#039;s methodology is aimed squarely at UHI and UHI trends, not at &quot;urbanization&quot; as such.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#220: Earle Williams:</p>
<p>Where there is no calm-windy trend, Parker is not claiming a lack of urbanization, but a lack of UHI.</p>
<p>It is conceivable that there could be increasing urbanization w/o increasing UHI. This brings us back into the regime of urban cool spots &amp; parks.</p>
<p>So if you want to falsify Parker&#8217;s hypothesis, it seems to me that you have to:</p>
<p>a) Measure directly the UHI, by comparing neighboring (but differently urbanized) points;</p>
<p>b) Establish a trend in the UHI over time; and</p>
<p>c) Demonstrate that this trend DOES NOT show up in the calm-windy temperature measurement signal.</p>
<p>This would be very welcome. However, I point out that it will take:<br />
- Space: to do a direct UHI measurement; and<br />
- Time: to see how the trends develop.</p>
<p>You cannot do this by simply looking at proxies such as census figures and electricity bills, or you will still be left with the question of how good the proxy is. Parker&#8217;s methodology is aimed squarely at UHI and UHI trends, not at &#8220;urbanization&#8221; as such.</p>
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		<title>By: MarkW</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89738</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[MarkW]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 22:24:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89738</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[you aren&#039;t worth a full analysis]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>you aren&#8217;t worth a full analysis</p>
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		<title>By: Boris</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/05/27/more-iso-2000-weather-stations-from-jones-and-hansen/#comment-89737</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Boris]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 20:48:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1616#comment-89737</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[224: You forgot my sentence fragments, my questionable use of nonrestrictive elements, and my inconsistency in using quotation marks around &quot;gotcha&quot; but not &quot;moment.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>224: You forgot my sentence fragments, my questionable use of nonrestrictive elements, and my inconsistency in using quotation marks around &#8220;gotcha&#8221; but not &#8220;moment.&#8221;</p>
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