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	<title>Comments on: Central Park: Will the real Slim Shady please stand up?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/</link>
	<description>by Steve McIntyre</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 18 May 2013 19:12:55 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: More Global Warming Alarmist Games: Doctoring the Temperature Record - Forbes</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-331557</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[More Global Warming Alarmist Games: Doctoring the Temperature Record - Forbes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2012 20:04:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-331557</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] then report on the surface temperature data. Specifically how do such biases show up in the data? Partisans adjust the raw data to make it seem like there was a greater urban heat island effect in New York City 100 years ago, [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] then report on the surface temperature data. Specifically how do such biases show up in the data? Partisans adjust the raw data to make it seem like there was a greater urban heat island effect in New York City 100 years ago, [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Hector M.</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-229930</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Hector M.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 May 2010 20:35:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-229930</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Fascinanter and fascinanter.

What I&#039;d like to remark is that using local resident population (e.g. residents of Mannhattan) as a marker of the intensity of urbanization in the area) may be misleading. Heat generation in Mannhattan is partially created by non-residents that drive cars or sit in offices within the area (but live in the metro area or beyond). Thus the UHI effect should be measured in a different fashion. One proposal is using some station covering a similar historical period, located at the same general climate, but in a more rural area. In 1900 probably temps in Mannhattan were not much different than temps in areas in N.Jersey or Conn. that are now leafy suburbs, but the two may have unaccountably diverged over time between, say, 1900 and 2010. The difference may be a measure of the UHI.

Example from the city I live in now. The main station of Buenos Aires city is also in a kind of midtown park (the Agricultural School of BA University), surrounded by asphalt, cement, many-storied bldgs and many factorties. Nowadays this station routinely gives 3°C more than some stations located in the outskirts of the metro area (including the main airport), although all are within 30-40 miles of each other and within the same general climatic and geographical zone. I am now trying to reconstruct the series of the outskirts from records at various locations that start at different years and have some discontinuities, but my guess is I&#039;ll find a divergence between the Agric School station and the more &quot;rural&quot; ones around this huge metro area (pop &gt; 13 million). Has anybody done the same for NYC?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fascinanter and fascinanter.</p>
<p>What I&#8217;d like to remark is that using local resident population (e.g. residents of Mannhattan) as a marker of the intensity of urbanization in the area) may be misleading. Heat generation in Mannhattan is partially created by non-residents that drive cars or sit in offices within the area (but live in the metro area or beyond). Thus the UHI effect should be measured in a different fashion. One proposal is using some station covering a similar historical period, located at the same general climate, but in a more rural area. In 1900 probably temps in Mannhattan were not much different than temps in areas in N.Jersey or Conn. that are now leafy suburbs, but the two may have unaccountably diverged over time between, say, 1900 and 2010. The difference may be a measure of the UHI.</p>
<p>Example from the city I live in now. The main station of Buenos Aires city is also in a kind of midtown park (the Agricultural School of BA University), surrounded by asphalt, cement, many-storied bldgs and many factorties. Nowadays this station routinely gives 3°C more than some stations located in the outskirts of the metro area (including the main airport), although all are within 30-40 miles of each other and within the same general climatic and geographical zone. I am now trying to reconstruct the series of the outskirts from records at various locations that start at different years and have some discontinuities, but my guess is I&#8217;ll find a divergence between the Agric School station and the more &#8220;rural&#8221; ones around this huge metro area (pop &gt; 13 million). Has anybody done the same for NYC?</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie A</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-215878</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Charlie A]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 21:33:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-215878</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have simple questions:

Is there anyone at NOAA that we can ask about the logic and justification for these specific corrections?

Has anyone at NOAA said whether or not they consider these corrections to be proper?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have simple questions:</p>
<p>Is there anyone at NOAA that we can ask about the logic and justification for these specific corrections?</p>
<p>Has anyone at NOAA said whether or not they consider these corrections to be proper?</p>
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		<title>By: Climate Gate – All the manipulations and lies revealed 222 &#171; UD/RK Samhälls Debatt</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-215770</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Climate Gate – All the manipulations and lies revealed 222 &#171; UD/RK Samhälls Debatt]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 10:16:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-215770</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] led Steve McIntyre here to quip “If one reverse engineers this adjustment to calculate the New York City population used [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] led Steve McIntyre here to quip “If one reverse engineers this adjustment to calculate the New York City population used [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-93882</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ian]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Dec 2009 14:31:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-93882</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[All the recent comments about trees and whether an UHI correction is appropriate misses the point. The stunning thing to me is the use of a shockingly wrong UHI correction to manufacture a hockeystick warming trend where none was initially present. It is particularly egregious since a UHI adjustment should be expected to reduce the size of any observed warming trend. I therefore find it extremely hard to believe that such an `error&#039; would go undetected which makes me wonder whether it was in fact not an error at all. This kind of scientific misconduct is so outrageous that all involved should be ceremonially stripped of their doctorates, locked in a small cell, and forced to mark first year statistics exam papers for the rest of their natural lives.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All the recent comments about trees and whether an UHI correction is appropriate misses the point. The stunning thing to me is the use of a shockingly wrong UHI correction to manufacture a hockeystick warming trend where none was initially present. It is particularly egregious since a UHI adjustment should be expected to reduce the size of any observed warming trend. I therefore find it extremely hard to believe that such an `error&#8217; would go undetected which makes me wonder whether it was in fact not an error at all. This kind of scientific misconduct is so outrageous that all involved should be ceremonially stripped of their doctorates, locked in a small cell, and forced to mark first year statistics exam papers for the rest of their natural lives.</p>
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		<title>By: Are We Feeling Warmer Yet? UPDATED With Additional Studies &#171; The EIW Network</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-93881</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Are We Feeling Warmer Yet? UPDATED With Additional Studies &#171; The EIW Network]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Dec 2009 16:52:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-93881</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Park: Will the real Slim Shady please stand up?” on Central Park data raw versus adjusted here. Read the comments. As one poster noted could this be a ‘smoking gun&#039; on data [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Park: Will the real Slim Shady please stand up?” on Central Park data raw versus adjusted here. Read the comments. As one poster noted could this be a ‘smoking gun&#8217; on data [...]</p>
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		<title>By: aurbo</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-93880</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[aurbo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 06:11:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-93880</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[First, thanks to #132 above for resurrecting this CA post which I contributed to almost 2.5 years ago.

The main thrust of the post was to show the outrageous magnitude of the NCDC adjustments for NYC Central Park especially during the past 50 years. The difference between the raw and adjusted temperatures peaked out prior to 1990 at about 3.5°C! Justification, or the lack thereof for these adjustments are well discussed in about the first 100 posts, after which the responders strayed away from the basic atrocity of &quot;UHI&quot; adjustments of this magnitude and went to arguing about the change in siting, instrumentation and especially exposure...whether shaded or otherwise. Most of these effects are significantly less important than the magnitude of the adjustment itself. The effect of daytime shading from the sun is considerably offset by the limitation the same shading puts on the effectiveness of nocturnal radiational cooling.

Also, one should note that through this period, the CP raw data tracked very well with other NYC sites...LGA, JFK, EWR, TEB and the City Office in Lower Manhattan. These relationships were solid enough so that when the CP site became unmanned and observations were remoted to the new Rockefeller Center location of the NYC WX Office, we could spot a temperature sensor drift within a day or two. At this point we would call the Rock Center office and within a another day or two they would send someone out to the CP site to recalibrate the sensor system. We could tell exactly when this occurred because, depending on the degree of drift, there would be an observable discontinuity in the hourly METAR string. The problem was sharply reduced after the newer MMTS sensors were installed.

The point is that there can be no logical meteorological reason for altering the record by reducing NYC temps in the city by 6°F to 7°F in the 1960-1990 period, and then nearly linearly reducing the negative adjustment from 1990 to 2005 at about 1.7°C per year! That&#039;s about the equivalent of moving the NYC thermometer southward to Richmond, VA.

I, and a few others, brought this obvious maladjustment to light some 2.5 years ago and have yet to receive an acknowledgment, much less a satisfactory answer.

Recently, NCDC quietly scrapped USHCNv1 UHI scheme and replaced it with a new measurement of &quot;homogeneity&quot; which uses individual station data inflection points (AKA change-point analysis) that are viewed as biases needing adjustment, and then combining the HCN stations with one of perhaps several nearby COOP stations to create a &quot;pairwise&quot; SHAP (Station History Adjustment Program) algorithm. A discussion of this program can be found in the 2009 July &lt;i&gt;BAMS&lt;/i&gt; 90, 993-1007. Unfortunately, the SHAP algorithm and coding is not provided there or in the listed referenced papers.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First, thanks to #132 above for resurrecting this CA post which I contributed to almost 2.5 years ago.</p>
<p>The main thrust of the post was to show the outrageous magnitude of the NCDC adjustments for NYC Central Park especially during the past 50 years. The difference between the raw and adjusted temperatures peaked out prior to 1990 at about 3.5°C! Justification, or the lack thereof for these adjustments are well discussed in about the first 100 posts, after which the responders strayed away from the basic atrocity of &#8220;UHI&#8221; adjustments of this magnitude and went to arguing about the change in siting, instrumentation and especially exposure&#8230;whether shaded or otherwise. Most of these effects are significantly less important than the magnitude of the adjustment itself. The effect of daytime shading from the sun is considerably offset by the limitation the same shading puts on the effectiveness of nocturnal radiational cooling.</p>
<p>Also, one should note that through this period, the CP raw data tracked very well with other NYC sites&#8230;LGA, JFK, EWR, TEB and the City Office in Lower Manhattan. These relationships were solid enough so that when the CP site became unmanned and observations were remoted to the new Rockefeller Center location of the NYC WX Office, we could spot a temperature sensor drift within a day or two. At this point we would call the Rock Center office and within a another day or two they would send someone out to the CP site to recalibrate the sensor system. We could tell exactly when this occurred because, depending on the degree of drift, there would be an observable discontinuity in the hourly METAR string. The problem was sharply reduced after the newer MMTS sensors were installed.</p>
<p>The point is that there can be no logical meteorological reason for altering the record by reducing NYC temps in the city by 6°F to 7°F in the 1960-1990 period, and then nearly linearly reducing the negative adjustment from 1990 to 2005 at about 1.7°C per year! That&#8217;s about the equivalent of moving the NYC thermometer southward to Richmond, VA.</p>
<p>I, and a few others, brought this obvious maladjustment to light some 2.5 years ago and have yet to receive an acknowledgment, much less a satisfactory answer.</p>
<p>Recently, NCDC quietly scrapped USHCNv1 UHI scheme and replaced it with a new measurement of &#8220;homogeneity&#8221; which uses individual station data inflection points (AKA change-point analysis) that are viewed as biases needing adjustment, and then combining the HCN stations with one of perhaps several nearby COOP stations to create a &#8220;pairwise&#8221; SHAP (Station History Adjustment Program) algorithm. A discussion of this program can be found in the 2009 July <i>BAMS</i> 90, 993-1007. Unfortunately, the SHAP algorithm and coding is not provided there or in the listed referenced papers.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: bender</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-93879</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bender]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 05:16:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-93879</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Re: &lt;a href=&quot;#comment-367022&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;NikFromNYC (#132)&lt;/a&gt;,
No it doesn&#039;t. Without knowing what fraction of stations are like NYC CP you have no idea how many are over-corrected vs. under-corrected. The analysis of Ross McKitrick and Pat Michaels suggests that land-use/UHI effects are quite UNDER-ESTIMATED.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: <a href="#comment-367022" rel="nofollow">NikFromNYC (#132)</a>,<br />
No it doesn&#8217;t. Without knowing what fraction of stations are like NYC CP you have no idea how many are over-corrected vs. under-corrected. The analysis of Ross McKitrick and Pat Michaels suggests that land-use/UHI effects are quite UNDER-ESTIMATED.</p>
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		<title>By: NikFromNYC</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-93878</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[NikFromNYC]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 19:59:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-93878</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This issue actually suggest that the UHI effect has been quite over-estimated.

Ironic that the place observation bias kicks in is in the exact correction they must fine painful to apply.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This issue actually suggest that the UHI effect has been quite over-estimated.</p>
<p>Ironic that the place observation bias kicks in is in the exact correction they must fine painful to apply.</p>
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		<title>By: Meteorological Technician</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2007/07/05/central-park-will-the-real-slim-shady-please-stand-up/#comment-93877</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Meteorological Technician]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Sep 2007 23:40:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1798#comment-93877</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;strong&gt;Gunnar says:

September 22nd, 2007 at 7:35 am
&gt;&gt; to produce valid weather forecasts. The logic is obvious when you try to use the data to produce a weather forecast.

I cant believe you missed the whole point that were not trying to take measurements in order to predict the weather. Were trying to measure the
thermodynamic state of the earth for the purposes of CLIMATE studies.
The bottom line is that we operate on completely different levels of abstraction. Lets just agree to disagree.&lt;/strong&gt;

How about we agree that you don&#039;t have a clue and you stop embarrassing yourself?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Gunnar says:</p>
<p>September 22nd, 2007 at 7:35 am<br />
&gt;&gt; to produce valid weather forecasts. The logic is obvious when you try to use the data to produce a weather forecast.</p>
<p>I cant believe you missed the whole point that were not trying to take measurements in order to predict the weather. Were trying to measure the<br />
thermodynamic state of the earth for the purposes of CLIMATE studies.<br />
The bottom line is that we operate on completely different levels of abstraction. Lets just agree to disagree.</strong></p>
<p>How about we agree that you don&#8217;t have a clue and you stop embarrassing yourself?</p>
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