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	<title>Comments on: Phil Jones and the China Network: Part 1</title>
	<atom:link href="http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/</link>
	<description>by Steve McIntyre</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 20 Jun 2013 11:17:13 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Assessment of the first consensus prediction on climate change - Page 9 - US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-391309</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Assessment of the first consensus prediction on climate change - Page 9 - US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jan 2013 11:24:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-391309</guid>
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		<title>By: hr</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-245112</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[hr]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Nov 2010 09:26:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-245112</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think the relevant passage in the main text of Jones et al (1990) is: &quot;It is unlikely that the remaining unsampled areas of the developing countries in tropical climates, or other highly populated parts of Europe, could significantly increase the overall urban bias above 0.05C during the twentieth century.&quot; (p.172, penultimate paragraph).  I have found no other mention of the 0.05C figure in the paper, except where it is implied in the final sentence of the abstract on p 169 (see below).  

The above passage seems to be combining (a) the authors&#039; conclusions from all 3 regions included in the 1990 study (eastern China, eastern Australia and European parts of Soviet Union) with (b) results from earlier studies of the contiguous USA and (c) data from other yet to be sampled land areas. The 0.05C seems to refer to this combination of (a), (b) and (c).  But maybe I have misunderstood it.  Anybody else like to venture an opinion? 
 
Another point which is worth bearing in mind is that although the data on eastern China came from 42 pairs of geographically associated &#039;rural&#039;(in fact small town) and &#039;urban&#039; (big city)sites, it seems that Jones et al (1990) did not make comparisons between the two individual members of each pair. Instead &quot;From the 42-station rural network, we formed an average (RCHI, Fig. 2c) for eastern China using the inverse-weighting gridding scheme.  The 42 station urban network (UCHI) was averaged in the same way.&quot; (p 171)
(Can anyone tell me what &#039;inverse-weighting gridding scheme&#039; means?)

Later on in the paper (top of p 172) is the following passage:  &quot;The warming in UCHI is 0.39C, considerably higher than that in RCHI. For this region, UCHI is the only series for which warming is statistically significant.&quot;  It should be noted that the 0.39C warming referred to here was over a period of 3 decades (1954-1983). Warming of 0.23C was found in the corresponding &#039;rural&#039; set over the same 30 year period, but not considered to be statistically significant.  

This interesting result is however apparently disregarded in the conclusion (penultimate para of p 172, see above) and in the summary (p 169) which reads &quot;The results show that the urbanization influence in two of the most widely used hemispheric data sets (refs to 3 earlier papers) is, at most, an order of magnitude less than the warming seen on a century timescale&quot;. 

The later paper by Wang et al (1990) does however treat the same 42 station pairs as individual pairs and comes up with different conclusions as to the magnitude of the urban effect on warming trends in eastern China. I find it interesting that Wang and Karl, who had both been co-authors of Jones et al (1990), found it necessary to publicly contradict in Wang et al (1990) conclusions which they themselves had signed up to less than 3 months previously. 

Chronology of the two papers:
Jones et al: published 13 September 1990, Nature.
Wang et al: received 24 August, revised 12 October, accepted 15 October, published December 1990, GRL.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the relevant passage in the main text of Jones et al (1990) is: &#8220;It is unlikely that the remaining unsampled areas of the developing countries in tropical climates, or other highly populated parts of Europe, could significantly increase the overall urban bias above 0.05C during the twentieth century.&#8221; (p.172, penultimate paragraph).  I have found no other mention of the 0.05C figure in the paper, except where it is implied in the final sentence of the abstract on p 169 (see below).  </p>
<p>The above passage seems to be combining (a) the authors&#8217; conclusions from all 3 regions included in the 1990 study (eastern China, eastern Australia and European parts of Soviet Union) with (b) results from earlier studies of the contiguous USA and (c) data from other yet to be sampled land areas. The 0.05C seems to refer to this combination of (a), (b) and (c).  But maybe I have misunderstood it.  Anybody else like to venture an opinion? </p>
<p>Another point which is worth bearing in mind is that although the data on eastern China came from 42 pairs of geographically associated &#8216;rural&#8217;(in fact small town) and &#8216;urban&#8217; (big city)sites, it seems that Jones et al (1990) did not make comparisons between the two individual members of each pair. Instead &#8220;From the 42-station rural network, we formed an average (RCHI, Fig. 2c) for eastern China using the inverse-weighting gridding scheme.  The 42 station urban network (UCHI) was averaged in the same way.&#8221; (p 171)<br />
(Can anyone tell me what &#8216;inverse-weighting gridding scheme&#8217; means?)</p>
<p>Later on in the paper (top of p 172) is the following passage:  &#8220;The warming in UCHI is 0.39C, considerably higher than that in RCHI. For this region, UCHI is the only series for which warming is statistically significant.&#8221;  It should be noted that the 0.39C warming referred to here was over a period of 3 decades (1954-1983). Warming of 0.23C was found in the corresponding &#8216;rural&#8217; set over the same 30 year period, but not considered to be statistically significant.  </p>
<p>This interesting result is however apparently disregarded in the conclusion (penultimate para of p 172, see above) and in the summary (p 169) which reads &#8220;The results show that the urbanization influence in two of the most widely used hemispheric data sets (refs to 3 earlier papers) is, at most, an order of magnitude less than the warming seen on a century timescale&#8221;. </p>
<p>The later paper by Wang et al (1990) does however treat the same 42 station pairs as individual pairs and comes up with different conclusions as to the magnitude of the urban effect on warming trends in eastern China. I find it interesting that Wang and Karl, who had both been co-authors of Jones et al (1990), found it necessary to publicly contradict in Wang et al (1990) conclusions which they themselves had signed up to less than 3 months previously. </p>
<p>Chronology of the two papers:<br />
Jones et al: published 13 September 1990, Nature.<br />
Wang et al: received 24 August, revised 12 October, accepted 15 October, published December 1990, GRL.</p>
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		<title>By: Niche Modeling &#187; Altering the weather data</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-245111</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Niche Modeling &#187; Altering the weather data]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Nov 2010 09:00:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-245111</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] And check out CA&#8217;s magnificent series on Phil Jones and the China Network [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] And check out CA&#8217;s magnificent series on Phil Jones and the China Network [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Chris BC</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-245108</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris BC]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Nov 2010 07:21:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-245108</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The usual fine work and extensive research here in installment 1, along with an unfortunate reminder of what is perhaps Steve&#039;s worst flaw.  

When you consider everything that is blatantly obvious about UHI over time, including the growth of air conditioning and other energy use, as well as pavement and asphalt (as pointed out above by others), the veracity of Jones 1990 is not really in question.  It is very quickly obvious that you are faced with two options, either they are extremely ignorant or they are lying.  Given their educations and positions the former is extremely unlikely, and that leaves us with Keenan&#039;s position.  And that&#039;s really the best way to put it.

Onward to part 2.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The usual fine work and extensive research here in installment 1, along with an unfortunate reminder of what is perhaps Steve&#8217;s worst flaw.  </p>
<p>When you consider everything that is blatantly obvious about UHI over time, including the growth of air conditioning and other energy use, as well as pavement and asphalt (as pointed out above by others), the veracity of Jones 1990 is not really in question.  It is very quickly obvious that you are faced with two options, either they are extremely ignorant or they are lying.  Given their educations and positions the former is extremely unlikely, and that leaves us with Keenan&#8217;s position.  And that&#8217;s really the best way to put it.</p>
<p>Onward to part 2.</p>
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		<title>By: Phil Jones and the Chinese weather station corruption &#124; Watts Up With That?</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-245068</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Phil Jones and the Chinese weather station corruption &#124; Watts Up With That?]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Nov 2010 15:56:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-245068</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Part 1 Part 2 [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Part 1 Part 2 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Climate Change Debate Thread - Page 311</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-245052</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[The Climate Change Debate Thread - Page 311]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Nov 2010 09:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-245052</guid>
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		<title>By: Phil Jones and the China Network: Part 3 &#171; Climate Audit</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-245012</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Phil Jones and the China Network: Part 3 &#171; Climate Audit]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Nov 2010 20:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-245012</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Part 1 Part 2 [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Part 1 Part 2 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Frank</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-244972</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Frank]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2010 19:10:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-244972</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Steve:  Thanks to Varco&#039;s link, I read the Jones 1990 Nature paper and found it totally absurd.  Jones analyzes SMALL paired sets of urban and rural stations for three regions.  If I am reading Table I correctly, these data sets are so small and/or cover such a short period of time that NO STATISTICALLY SIGNIFICANT warming can be found in one region (USSR), while warming reaches statistical significance in urban, but not rural, China and both areas of Australia.  Then, with data sets so small that warmings of 0.23 degC in 30 years (China) and 0.38 degC in 86 years (USSR) are not statistically significant, he concludes that UHI has to be less than 0.05 degC for the whole explicative-deleted century!  The error in the difference of two means (urban vs rural) must be greater than error in the means themselves. (ca 1.4X greater).  The only changes that reach statistical significance are ca 0.50 degC over 58 years and 0.39 degC over 30 years, about 0.1 degC/decade for data sets and 0.15 degC/decade for the difference between data sets, which is 1.5 degC for the century.  

(I presume you and others must have noted these problems sometime in the past, but you haven&#039;t mentioned them yet in this series of posts.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve:  Thanks to Varco&#8217;s link, I read the Jones 1990 Nature paper and found it totally absurd.  Jones analyzes SMALL paired sets of urban and rural stations for three regions.  If I am reading Table I correctly, these data sets are so small and/or cover such a short period of time that NO STATISTICALLY SIGNIFICANT warming can be found in one region (USSR), while warming reaches statistical significance in urban, but not rural, China and both areas of Australia.  Then, with data sets so small that warmings of 0.23 degC in 30 years (China) and 0.38 degC in 86 years (USSR) are not statistically significant, he concludes that UHI has to be less than 0.05 degC for the whole explicative-deleted century!  The error in the difference of two means (urban vs rural) must be greater than error in the means themselves. (ca 1.4X greater).  The only changes that reach statistical significance are ca 0.50 degC over 58 years and 0.39 degC over 30 years, about 0.1 degC/decade for data sets and 0.15 degC/decade for the difference between data sets, which is 1.5 degC for the century.  </p>
<p>(I presume you and others must have noted these problems sometime in the past, but you haven&#8217;t mentioned them yet in this series of posts.)</p>
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		<title>By: Varco</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-244946</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Varco]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2010 12:44:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-244946</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[PaulM, I agree. I could not see any justification. It was as if a paragraph/page was missing.

Thanks for the S.D. observation.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PaulM, I agree. I could not see any justification. It was as if a paragraph/page was missing.</p>
<p>Thanks for the S.D. observation.</p>
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		<title>By: Bernie</title>
		<link>http://climateaudit.org/2010/11/03/phil-jones-and-the-china-network-part-1/#comment-244944</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bernie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2010 11:24:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateaudit.org/?p=12283#comment-244944</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Those with a skeptical view of Jones et al (1990)may want to look at &lt;a href=&quot;http://newhumanist.org.uk/2365/lies-damn-lies-and-chinese-science&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this take on Chinese Science&lt;/a&gt;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Those with a skeptical view of Jones et al (1990)may want to look at <a href="http://newhumanist.org.uk/2365/lies-damn-lies-and-chinese-science" rel="nofollow">this take on Chinese Science</a>.</p>
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